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#21 [url]

Jun 25 15 9:34 PM

I watched the second half. Chile are great to watch (almost like kamikaze football) though they do need a lot of opportunities per goal. Even the 5-0 vs Bolivia, they missed about 5 more goals (Vargas especially) missing the great chances created by Valdivia. Apparently Chile had 80% possession. Which made me wonder what the record was, or the non-minnow record.

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#23 [url]

Jun 26 15 3:36 PM

Yes. This is more Mark's subject, but the only slight difference between "I watched" and "I saw" is that the former sounds more like a deliberate choice, whereas "I saw" can also imply by coincidence.

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#24 [url]

Jun 27 15 12:27 PM

TheRoonBa wrote:
nfm24 wrote:
He is like somebody who has won a lottery to play football, and the coach is forced to pick him.

Perhaps his shampoo supplier also supports the team.

Not quite shampoo, but possibly a sham if some rumours from last month are true. Your suggestions might not be too far from the reality of Brazil's team: http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/news-and-comment/brazil-national-team-has-only-picked-marketable-players-by-commercial-partners-since-2006-claim-sao-paulo-newspaper-10257202.html

And in that website's preference for long-headline URLs, we learn that Chile were disturbingly dedicated to their goal of provoking Uruguay: http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/international/gonzalo-jara-banned-for-rest-of-the-2015-copa-america-after-he-inserted-finger-into-edinson-cavanis-+#%!-10344940.html

Last Edited By: mattsanger92 Jun 27 15 12:30 PM. Edited 2 times.

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#26 [url]

Jun 28 15 11:05 AM

Back onto football, and Brazil at least managed to score a few penalties against Paraguay this time...


The semi-final line-up interestingly has Argentinian coaches only, and all 4 countries are connected by border...

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#27 [url]

Jun 28 15 12:26 PM

mattsanger92 wrote:

The semi-final line-up interestingly has Argentinian coaches only, and all 4 countries are connected by border...

Not so amazing when the confederation consists of 10 nations only + inviting two guest teams. If this happens in Europa, Africa or Asia it's more exceptional. Same happened at the 1934 World Cup, all 4 semi finalists connected by border (Italy (#1) with Austria (#4), Austria with Germany (#3) and Germany with Czechoslovakia (#2)

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#28 [url]

Jun 29 15 8:56 AM

The legendary Brazilian world champion in 1958, José Altafini, commenting the match against Paraguay for the Italian TV, declared that this is the worst Seleção he remembers.
Well, I don't think so. Brazil lived other difficult periods. In the earliest 1990s situation was not more brilliant.
The point is that nowadays they need great forwards. Brazil have always had terrific forwards. Nowadays they have Neymar, who is ok, but guys like Hulk, Fred, Roberto Firmino and Robinho are just the shadow of Romário, Ronaldo, Rivaldo, Ronaldinho and so on...

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TheRoonBa

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#29 [url]

Jul 1 15 10:45 AM

If you think about it, one team cannot remain brilliant and untouchable forever, because eventually, the other teams will learn how to play against them. So, to retain their status, the Brazils of the world have to continually evolve their play to counteract the new tactics of their challengers. It is inevitable that there will be some negative periods while they try to find a new system. But these negative periods are only negative relatively. Brazil will never fall below number 30, for example. For other teams, this would be considered relatively successful.

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#30 [url]

Jul 1 15 6:10 PM

Mark, according to your ranking, when did Brazil touch their lowest position in, say, the last 30 years?

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#34 [url]

Jul 4 15 9:25 AM

Chile, Venezuela and Ecuador are the only countries that never conquered the trophy. Chile were runners-up four times, but at the 1962 World Cup they won the bronze medal.

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TheRoonBa

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#36 [url]

Jul 4 15 10:06 AM

Luca wrote:
Mark, according to your ranking, when did Brazil touch their lowest position in, say, the last 30 years?

I have no idea as my ranking is broken.  So, looking at elo ratings, Brazil's worst position in the rankings was in November 2001, when they were 18th after losing 3-1 to Bolivia in a World Cup Qualifier.  However, they were 10th directly before that match, and recovered to 10th position in the next 6 months.  Apart from the period between July 2001 and May 2002, they have not been outside the Top 10.

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#37 [url]

Jul 5 15 8:34 AM

TheRoonBa wrote:
Luca wrote:
Mark, according to your ranking, when did Brazil touch their lowest position in, say, the last 30 years?

I have no idea as my ranking is broken.  So, looking at elo ratings, Brazil's worst position in the rankings was in November 2001, when they were 18th after losing 3-1 to Bolivia in a World Cup Qualifier.  However, they were 10th directly before that match, and recovered to 10th position in the next 6 months.  Apart from the period between July 2001 and May 2002, they have not been outside the Top 10.
Thanks. Ah, I remember that period. Brazil had mediocre performances both in Confederations Cup and in Copa América. Their World Cup Qualifiers were a "Via Crucis", but then, in Korea & Japan, they exploded and won with merit. Football can be extremely crazy...

pieter wrote:
even Bolivia won the trophy, so if Chile does make it this time.....
This Chilean success is much more prestigious than the Bolivian one. In 1963, Uruguay were absent, while both Argentina and Brazil fielded very restricted teams. This year Copa América level was quite good in my opinion, so congrats to Chile. They're the worthiest winners. But I can't understand why a true champion like Carlos Tévez was not employed. Gonzalo Higuaín is one of the most overrated forwards in this generation. Tévez is a "tiger", unbelievable the fact he was ignored. Argentina won their last official title in 1993. Since that year, they've lost 6 international finals: 1 World Cup, 2 Confederations Cups and 3 Copas América!!!!

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#38 [url]

Jul 10 15 9:59 AM

They put on Higuaín simply to play long hoofs into the channels against the small Chilean defenders. Before the game (and before the tournament) all the pundits were saying how Chile didn't have any real defenders, and they would get stuck against a "better" side like Argentina. But they forgot that if you play midfielders in defence you benefit from improved ball possession at the back, and there aren't so many aimless hoofs.

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#39 [url]

Jul 11 15 8:48 AM

And what about all the criticisms towards Lionel Messi? I think they're exaggerating. Ok, he was not the same player we admire at Camp Nou with Barcelona, but he didn't do a bad Copa América. It was not Messi's fault if Ángel di María injured in the first half and if Kun Agüero and Gonzalo Higuaín are never decisive like, say, Neymar and Luis Suárez are. By the way, I don't think he deserved the best player award. After watching almost all the games of Chile, I do believe Arturo Vidal or Gary Medel would have been worthier winners.

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#40 [url]

Jul 11 15 10:20 AM

Vidal crashed a Ferrari, that obviously brought his score down with the technical study group smiley: wink.


I agree with everything you said on Messi though, I'm not one of those people saying he's the ultimate player but if he has a great game (like he did often), he shouldn't be criticised for not being more great, as you said, football is a team sport, Messi might well have pulled off some miracle goal but on these occasions it didn't happen, it's not like he was making errors all over the place. He shouldn't have turned down the MVP award when he won it though, and the organisers shouldn't have dropped the subject altogether because of this, I understand what he means from the gesture but it seems disrespectful to the tournament itself to not go up and accept it, just take your trophy with a miserable face like last time Lionel... smiley: indifferent

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